Archive for the 'Religion' Category

A New Beginning

Published on January 17, 2009 in Books, General and Religion. 3 Comments

I think it’s a little obvious to point out that I haven’t posted very much lately. However, I renewed my domain subscription for another two years yesterday, so onthetables.com will be around, even if the postings aren’t.

Lots of things have happened in the past few weeks, and I feel like it would be pretty boring to try and describe them from this particular vantage point, so I’ll make note of a few things that I find important.

I didn’t make any New Year’s resolutions, partly for the fact that I don’t like the feeling of failing to meet them and partly because I’m lazy. I did, however, have a few general ideas I though would be feasible and could improve my life in a small way. The first was to think more kindly on those less fortunate than me, which, although against most of the things in my nature, has been made more salient in my life since being surrounded by both a wealth of needy Chinese citizens and a particularly compassionate Caitlin. She even went so far as to have a blog post on the topic hijacked by the San Francisco Chronicle.

I haven’t done anything worth blogging about, but I wanted to point out it’s on the list.

The second thing I’ve been trying to do is to read more books. As many of you know, I have a pretty good ability to pretend to read books. In fact, I estimate I read less than 5% of what was required by my classes in college, most of which demanded essays summarizing and quoting the material I had not read.

As a result, I feel a little regret that I can have intelligent literary conversations about books I have not even read, so it’s been a goal of mine to read more and internet less (I make no promises about creating new verbs, though). I suppose this got in full swing when I started having my students read Harry Potter, which led to me rereading the entire series with about one book per week.

There wasn’t much reading after Christmas, when I finished Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows, but I went through my book collection and picked out ones I wanted to bring back to China.

In the process of combing through my items, I discovered an unused Borders gift card, so I found myself the bearer of limited book-buying power. Unfortunately, I have a hard time making decisions, and it took three Borders locations, many hours, and one increasingly impatient Caitlin to use the entire value of the card. I think my main problem is that I buy most of my books through the Amazon Marketplace, meaning that I know I can get pretty much the same book cheaper if I look. And even though I know I didn’t pay for the card in the first place — and that it’s essentially free money, asking for me to buy something I normally wouldn’t —, I have a very difficult time buying a book at full price knowing I could get two or three for the same value. I eventually bought two bargain books and one at full price, just so I could relieve Caitlin of her patient girlfriend duties.

I suppose the reason for explaining all that is because I just finished my full-priced book, The Year of Living Biblically: One Man’s Humble Quest to Follow the Bible as Literally as Possible by A.J. Jacobs. Considering the amount of anguish that went into choosing the book, I expected to be let down because of the arbitrarily imposed high expectations. Fortunately, things worked out pretty well — both for my new reading appetite and the publisher’s full-priced sale.

I chose the book because it piqued several of my interests. I’ve studied religion for several years, a task I have increasingly come to realize is because I am drawn to comprehending the incomprehensibility of it. That isn’t to say I’m trying to understand the impossible, but rather, I’m amazed at the extent at which it is completely incapable of being understood.

A.J. Jacobs, a man formerly known for his successful quest to read the entire Encyclopedia Britannica, spends an entire year attempting to follow the bible as literally as possible. This is an openly agnostic man of Jewish heritage, embarking on a journey of ostracism and confusion to those around him. His experiment began with the simple pondering of what it would be like to obey the bible for a year — would this fulfill some religious requirement from God, and he would have a miraculous revelation?

One of the main reasons I found this book so interesting is that it paralleled my experience with the Mormons. He began his journey as a normal agnostic, with a genuine interest in understanding biblical religion. He experiences some pretty crazy things, many of which he disagrees with completely, but by the end, he understands that there is something to it — not necessarily of God, but at least a unifying force of general good.

I still am amazed at this man’s commitment to his quest. In one of the first parts of the book, he decides that he should pray three times a day for 10 minutes at a time. He decides to open his arms wide, “hoping to catch God’s signal.” The thing is, though, he genuinely tries to pray. This is a man who does not believe in God, trying more honestly than most who do.

I found the book in the Humor section, but I don’t know if that’s where I would put it. I found it more deeply moving than most of my religious studies textbooks and commentaries. I think that all those who have a stance on Judeo-Christian religion should read this book. It’s not a book by an agnostic proving that atheism is the only logical solution, and it’s not a book about his miraculous conversion. It’s a book about an agnostic who spends a year trying to understand religion and comes away with a deeper respect for others but ultimately the same agnostic status.

I don’t think anyone will be converted one way or the other by reading this book, but I do think there is a valuable level of respect and learning that can come from seeing this journey. And I think everyone could do with a little more respect and learning, especially me.

My Dealings With the Mormons, Part 10

Published on January 13, 2008 in Humor and Religion. 3 Comments

This is part 10 of a series. It begins here.

The afternoon after I had had my long chat with Randy, I was awoken from a rather pleasant nap by my phone vibrating in my pocket. I noticed a (530) phone number, so I picked up, expecting someone from Davis. Surprise, surprise, it was a Mormon.

Apparently, the eager young missionaries tried to find my apartment, but decided it doesn’t exist. I don’t blame them; it’s labeled very strangely. I live at the backside of our complex, so the address is on a parallel street. In order to get to our apartment, however, you must enter from another street.

She called to ask how to get to the apartment. I was a bit confused, explaining that I’m not actually at the apartment and wouldn’t be for a few more days. Also, I thought it was extremely rude for them to show up unannounced, as I did not want missionaries bothering my roommates. I asked if they could call me in a week in order to set up an appointment. This is exactly what happened with the last missionaries, so I expected it to be normal protocol.

Actually, they were unable to do that. Apparently, the missionaries were given a cell phone that can only make (530) calls. Since my phone number is outside of that, they couldn’t call me. Annoyed that rude Mormons woke me from my nap, I was bitter and snappy with the lady on the phone, which I’m fairly certain came through to her end.

“They’re two very nice gentlemen, just like you,” she said.

Well, what was I to do? I wasn’t about to set an appointment, since neither my work nor school schedule had been settled yet. The best thing would be for the missionaries to call me once I got back to town, but apparently, that was impossible. “Well, that’s what they did last year,” I snapped at the woman. “I do not see any reason why you can’t do it again.”

She tried to explain, but I stopped caring. “How about, one week from now, you call me and set up an appointment,” I said. “You can obviously call me, so that should work, right?”

She made some sort of attempt at explaining that it wasn’t her job to do so, but eventually said that something would work out.

It’s been two weeks and I haven’t heard from any Mormons.

Actually, I take that back. I mentioned the incident to Randy, who said that it must have been from the card I filled out in Salt Lake City. I thought that would be logical, but I remembered that the woman specifically said, “Randy told us that you would like to meet with some of our representatives.”

Efficiency is sometimes the bane of Mormonism.

My Dealings With the Mormons, Part 9

Published on January 13, 2008 in Humor and Religion. 0 Comments

This is part 9 of a series. It begins here.

As promised, this is the follow-up to the New York Missionary report.

New Year’s Day, I was out helping cut up some cardboard boxes when I received a phone call from Randy. We agreed on a time, the place left undetermined. Around 3:00 p.m., he called me back and for the sake of simplicity, I drove over to his place.

So here we were, two friends from high school who had recently been reintroduced, both poised to discuss religion. I’m fairly certain we were both looking forward to the conversation, albeit for different reasons. I was excited because I knew it would be less proselytizing and more answering the particular questions I had accumulated (hastily scribbled on a scratch piece of paper).

Situated in their living room on adjacent couches, we began our conversation. I started by briefly explaining my history with the Mormon church (brief in comparison to this series), which seemed to impress him due to my inquisitive nature. Once we had settled my position with the church, I proceeded to ask my questions, allowing for further discussion on the matter. For lack of a better lead-in, here’s my interpretation of how it went:

Texts

As a Classics major, one of the things I base scholarship on is the reliability of original texts. As I have probably made clear elsewhere in this series, there are no original texts of the Book of Mormon. The golden plates were translated and given back to the angel. Also, there is little evidence of the language, a modified Egyptian, even existing. Again, I questioned why the style of the Book of Mormon is so similar to the style of the King James Version of the bible, despite the fact that certain linguistic characteristics of the KJV were uncommon even at the time it was translated, let alone 200 years later.

As far as the original texts are concerned, their lacking is a matter of faith. Also, Joseph Smith translated the Book of Mormon into the scriptural language of the day, which just so happened to be that of the KJV. Randy told a story of a non-Mormon who was asked to translate the book into some sort of Semitic language. As he was translating, he was surprised to find several strange phrases that were repeated in English, despite the fact that they were obscure. Strangely enough, they were common phrases in the Semitic languages. One of the few examples he could think of off the top of his head was “and it came to pass.”

My counter argument to that is that it seems like Joseph Smith was trying to mimic the bible, particularly the KJV. The phrase “and it came to pass” is the KJV translation of καὶ ἐγένετο in Greek, a very common expression that means something like “and it happened.” I’m sure it’s similar in Hebrew, as it comes up often in the Old Testament. The translation as “and it came to pass” was merely the convention of the KJV. In my opinion, the occurrence of that phrase in the Book of Mormon was not necessarily evidence of an original Semitic language, but it could rather be evidence of someone mimicking the KJV for tone, style, and and particular phrases.

I also asked about Joseph Smith’s translation of the bible. It seems he went over the bible and made an effort to clear things up, either ambiguous things or parts that would make things easier for the Mormon church. The few examples I saw were merely explaining the speaker or the addressee, yet there are apparently entire parts that are different in the JST. My major problem with this is that Joseph Smith was going off the KJV, itself a translation, which any good classicist knows is a huge problem. But apparently, Randy uses it merely as a supplement, since it is essentially the KJV with footnotes.

Also, I asked if he knew of any particular instances where additional manuscripts back up the JST over another translation, but he couldn’t give me precise examples. He did remind me that the manuscripts we have are all copies of the originals, so they all vary in reliability too, but I would still trust them over a very questionably reliable editor.

He also cited the witnesses of the tablets, as seen in the beginning of every Book of Mormon. I asked about those people, having heard that many had been excommunicated from the church. Randy did not deny this. In fact, he even informed me which ones. He explained that everyone goes through different struggles, and even though some came back and some didn’t, nobody ever denied their witness.

The Afterlife

What happens to good Mormons when they die? Randy asked what I understood, so I explained:

When good Mormons die, they get their own planet and populate it with their children, like how we are all God’s children on earth.

He seemed amused at the idea of a personal planet, but more or less agreed to that interpretation. Since families are such an important part of the Mormon religion, it makes sense that they would be so in the afterlife as well. Death is an extension of life, so the Mormon religion promises that the family here on earth extends to the family in death. This is why it’s important to have a good family and why the Mormons spend so much time researching genealogies, as they believe they can seal their ancestors long after they have died.

As part of the family idea, God has a wife. It is important for procreation that there be a mother and a father, so if we are to be God’s children, He must have a wife. Interestingly, they acknowledge her existence, but do not acknowledge her. They two are separate individuals as parents, but one in marriage. They justify this by the Hebrew word for God, “Elohim,” both plural and neuter. Most religions attribute this to a sort of royal “we,” but the Mormons look at it as an actual dualistic God.

At this, I questioned him by asking if they considered themselves polytheistic, having both a Heavenly Father and Mother, which he agreed to in some respect. He countered with the argument that Christians (which I corrected to Catholics) believe in the Trinity.

Tithing

Must a good Mormon give 10% before taxes? Now, I’m an anomaly when it comes to church and money, believing that they should remain as separate as possible (Luke 20:25). God does not require earthly money, just as government law does not require religious sacrifices. Most religions rely on the power of guilt to get members to donate money to the church. The Mormons, however, continue the tradition of tithing by requiring 10% of all income.

There are two sides to this argument. My side is that the two worlds do not need to intersect—that the church does not need earthly money in order to maintain strength. The other side argues that tithing is very scriptural, and there is nothing explicitly against it. On top of that, the money is not for personal profit, but for community activities, helping charities, training missionaries, producing free bibles, etc. Randy even added that there is also the belief that whatever you have is of God, so the donation of physical items to help others is not uncommon. Thus, many Mormons end up donating more than 10% to help others, sometimes reaching as high as 50%.

Storing Food

One of the interesting things about Mormon homes is the large amount of stored food. Good Mormons are supposed to have a year’s supply of food in storage. I was unclear about the purpose of this, having heard rumors of necessity for the apocalypse or some other great disaster. Randy explained that it’s primarily for the event of an emergency, that everyone can have enough to survive. He cited Hurricane Katrina, that the Mormons in New Orleans had their supply of food to help them and their neighbors stay alive. As far as he knew, there was no larger purpose than for emergencies such as that. Also, he added that most families only keep about 72 hours worth of food, not a full year’s supply.

Polygamy

The big issue. I was surprised at how open and honest he was. Actually, I wasn’t all that surprised, as I figured they all had to suffer through a lot of harassment regarding the topic. As expected, he explained that there were many widows in the church, and the men were needed to take care of them. Once the need had passed, polygamy was no longer necessary.

I asked what he knew about Joseph Smith excommunicating those who did not agree with polygamy, to which he explained that many people were excommunicated for various reasons, but he didn’t know anything about going against polygamy.

I brought up the notion that it was extremely convenient to get a revelation that polygamy was unacceptable right around the time when Utah was applying for statehood, and their polygamous lifestyle was looked down upon. Basically, Randy admitted that it was pretty convenient. But that’s where faith comes in.

Racism

This was a particularly pertinent topic for Randy, as he spent his mission in the heart of New York, a place filled with those of a darker skin than your typical Mormon. To refresh everyone’s memory, the common belief is that Mormons believe African Americans to be the descendants of Cain, and that they were not allowed in the church until the 1970s.

For that first part, Randy explained that it was a particular individual who did not speak as a representative of the church. Much like Al Gore inventing the internet, word spread and rumors flew.

For the second, he explained that it was never explicitly stated that African Americans could not enter into the priesthood, only that there was a statement in the 70s that allowed for everyone to do so. He mentioned that there were a few Black people as priests beforehand, but didn’t provide any further information. I also noted how convenient it was for that revelation, right around the time of a big civil rights push, but he again came back with faith.

Meso-American Studies

Really? It’s quite a big deal at BYU. Anything about professors losing tenure for publishing anything contrary to the Book of Mormon was news to Randy.

Jesus in Native American Records

If Jesus really came to the Americas, wouldn’t there be some sort of record of him? Randy pointed out that some people believe the stories of Quetzalcoatl are actually of Jesus. There are more examples, but he didn’t have them at hand.

Testimony

To satisfy a suspicion of Shane’s, I asked what he meant by his “testimony.” Basically, your personal testimony is a statement you make that affirms your belief in the bible and the Book of Mormon. When we were on our tour, we noticed that our guides said, “And I believe that the Book of Mormon is true” ad nauseam. When I suggested that by repeating something so much, a person could really convince him/herself of anything. He admitted that it seems a bit like brainwashing, but confessed that every time he says those words, the feeling of acceptance, love, and whatever else flows back inside him and helps him continue his job. I suppose it’s a personal thing.

That pretty much summed up my list. We helped his parents move boxes into the garage, talked some about how things have changed since high school, then we said goodbye. Being a good Mormon, he asked if I would like to speak with the two missionaries in my district in Davis, to which I accepted. I assumed that by the time they would call me, I would have a new list of questions.

And with that, I concluded my least biased and most informative interaction with a Mormon to date.

Continue reading here.

My Dealings With the Mormons, Part 8

Published on January 1, 2008 in Humor and Religion. 2 Comments

This is part 8 of a series. It begins here.

While we were in Salt Lake City, I received a Facebook invitation to a mission report by one of my friends from high school. Even though I hadn’t seen or talked to him in 3.5 years, I felt the natural curiosity about Mormonism, so I decided to do everything I could to attend. This would be the first time I would experience Mormonism from someone I knew well in a context outside of the religion.

Sunday, at 5:55 p.m., I showed up to Randy’s house for the 6 p.m. gathering. As usual, my punctuality threw people off guard, as their family was still finishing up dinner. There were a few other people who arrived when I did, so I made some awkward small talk and looked at pictures. As the minutes rolled on, more people showed up, eventually including people I knew from high school.

The audience mostly consisted of other Mormons, so the few (maybe 6) of us high school friends were the definite minority. Having had a relatively large experience with the religion, I really appreciated how Randy explained the basic principles while keeping it interesting to those who had grown up knowing these things or had already gone on their own mission.

It started, as expected, with Randy playing a song on the piano. The presentation had two purposes: to show his experiences on his mission to New York and to show non-Mormons what he believes. The format was mostly pictures with narrative, a few videos, and several stories about the people in the pictures.

I must admit, it was nice to see a different side of Randy. For the six years of school we had together, I had never heard him speak so openly about what he believed. This was understandable, as I’m sure most of the people I know have never heard me speak similarly. Also, as I’m sure the majority of the audience understood and was familiar with the topic, it was to be expected. Nonetheless, I really enjoyed listening to someone I knew outside the Mormon context speak so genuinely about the religion.

I came to the presentation filled with questions and comments, but I didn’t really ask any of them. I realized very quickly that the things I had to ask or say were not suited for a large group. They were not beneficial to the audience, only me.

In all, I came to respect Randy a lot more. Even though the religion expects it, it takes a substantial amount of strength and courage in order to go on a mission, especially in the heart of New York City. His personality was well suited for grabbing the attention of the public, as evidenced through knowing him and seeing videos of him in action.

In my observations of the religion, I had never had the opportunity to see what actually goes on in the mission. Being part of a constant partnership forces ideal performance, otherwise there are consequences. Yet the methods of converting, the training needed to go out, the lifestyle and expectations—these are all very interesting to me. In my opinion, it’s just another business part of the Mormon church. Yet undeniably, they are effective in converting.

As usual, this experience raised more questions for me. Uncomfortable with asking them and holding the whole group back, I asked Randy if we could meet up sometime this week to discuss things. Of course, this will mean more parts to the ever-growing saga, but what did you expect?

This post was initially going to be about what Randy had to share, but I ended up being more interested in my opinions of that. If you disagree with this decision, feel free to mention it in the comments and I will add more.

Continue reading here.

My Dealings With the Mormons, Part 7

Published on December 31, 2007 in Humor, Pictures and Religion. 7 Comments

This is part 7 of a series. It begins here.

It has been over 6 months since I have last updated my continuing story with the Mormons, so I think it’s about time to add a few more notes.

The past two weeks have been filled with Mormons, the center spotlight of the most popular series on my blog. Since Jayna and Shane have moved to Salt Lake City, they have experienced the heart of Mormon culture firsthand. As it is Christmas break, a time when families come together (out of affection or obligation), the parents, brother, and I made a road trip to the City of the Big Salty Lake.

Since Jayna and Shane had already been living there for a few months, they had encountered some of the strange peculiarities of the Mormon way of life. They had been welcomed, they had been fed. Since they are good citizens, they use the public library, a source that has provided them with the book, Mormon America: The Power and the Promise. Apparently a fascinating read, this book details the history and customs of the religion through an unbiased yet thoroughly inspected view. Dad found the book and didn’t put it down until it was finished.

While I have yet to read the book (my pleasure reading this break is focused on my usual dystopian genre), I was rather amazed to be immersed in the Mormon culture for a week. I first noticed something was different when I heard someone genuinely use the expression “Jeez Louise” in place of a more taboo expletive. Welcome to the world of Mormons.

Aside from being an extremely clean city, the streets and city blocks are ridiculously wide and are numbered up to the tens of thousands, all in relation to the Temple. The people are very friendly and take very good care of their appearance, although they do seem to like natural insulation, I guess to combat the cold winter months. We just bundled up and became bitter:

This is my general way of combating the cold.

As part of our being tourists, we had to take a Temple tour. As soon as we got to Temple Square, it started snowing, so they told us we could wait in the Visitor’s Center and they would come get us in 15 minutes. Punctuality wasn’t their thing, as about 25 minutes later, we were summoned outside, only to meet a mess of confusion, switching tour guides, and be ushered back inside the Visitor’s Center.

I should note, when we mentioned we would like a tour, the lady in the booth had to confirm that we would like one in English. I thought this was strange, but at least she was being nice by making sure the Asians didn’t need another language.

Amazingly, the white, English-speaking tour guides transfered us to the foreign Asian and Oceanic ones. This upset me quite a bit, not necessarily out of racism, but because I feel much less comfortable asking detailed questions to someone who probably won’t understand what I’m saying, much less be able to interpret and provide a reasonable answer. That, and the fact that my increasingly hard-of-hearing parents were going to have a difficult time understanding them. Their lack of punctuality and last-minute change of tour guide set the Mormons back two strikes in my book.

Since anyone willing to attend a tour of the Temple must be interested in Mormonism to some extent, the large portion of the tour consisted of an explanation of the religion with a mild intent to convert. Having had enough experience with the religion to write the entirety of this series, I was bored by their simplified version of the history and theology. With enough Mormon America in us, I think the rest were too. Also, it might have been due to their waining confidence in the language, but it seemed like the two tour guides merely echoed each other instead of adding on.

After the lecturing, we ventured out into the snowstorm, over to the tabernacle. Discourses on the construction and acoustics were moderately enthralling, but the warmth was even more appealing. Actually, I was a little sad the choir didn’t give me a personal performance, but I suppose that was out of the question.

More venturing in the snow led us to the other Visitor’s Center. We were ushered upstairs to stare at a giant, white, ethnically and geographically inaccurate Jesus. More lectures on prophets and translations of the Book of Mormon gave me difficulty keeping my mouth shut, but we politely persevered to the end.

In all, the tour was very clean and well organized, as is every other aspect of the Mormon religion (except, perhaps, their history). I didn’t feel like any particular questions of mine were answered, but new ones were definitely raised. Of course, we were asked to fill out cards with contact information, so I’m eager to see if they will start calling me again. It’s been too long since I’ve heard from them.

The rest of our trip was much less Mormon-filled, the majority satisfied by any sort of human interaction. While their theology is somewhat questionable, I cannot stress the quality of human life the religion produces. Salt Lake City is no doubt a giant city, but it maintains the friendliness, safety, and cleanliness that surpasses nearly every other city I have visited. In all my adventures with the Mormons, I have been amazed at the strange things they believe, but I have always been in awe at the happiness and goodness of those who believe them.

Continue reading here.

My Dealings With the Mormons, Part 6

Published on June 7, 2007 in Humor and Religion. 8 Comments

This is part 6 of a series. It begins here.

As I was cleaning in the kitchen last night, I received a phone call from our favorite number, (877) 200-9000. I poked my head out of the hall and yelled to AJ, “The Mormons are calling me!”

I answered the phone and hurried the polite young man through the spiel of all the information I already knew. He noticed I requested a visit from two of their representatives and wanted to know if I had the chance to meet with them.

“Yeah, that happened a few months ago.”

“Oh? Did they set up a second meeting?”

“No, I haven’t heard from them since.” Instead of having him try and fix what he would probably think of as a problem, I quickly added, “But I have their number, so I was going to call them and see if I could attend a service.” It wasn’t actually a lie–I’m still curious to see if their services are as ridiculous as I imagine.

“Well, that’s great. You have their number if you have any more questions or want to attend a service. Is there anything I can help you with?”

“No, that would be it.” And we hung up.

Seriously? Three and a half months after we had our little discussion/debate, they call me to talk about it? I suppose the long delay of calling was reasonable when I got the Book of Mormon, allowing time to read it and come back to it. But a meeting? Maybe they knew I fully documented the incident and would come back to my post to remember the events and be converted. Rarely do I know what the Mormons are thinking.

Continue reading here. 

Lenten Sacrifices

Published on February 27, 2007 in Humor and Religion. 6 Comments

In honor of Lent, Brandon and I have decided to participate in the annual sacrifices.  While most people give up little things, things the individual could consider a minor sin, we decided to go big.  We decided to give up a huge sin for the rest of our lives.  It might be tough, but it will be eternally rewarding.  So for at least the next thirty-some-odd days, Brandon and I are giving up hookers.

My Dealings With the Mormons, Part 5

Published on February 22, 2007 in Humor and Religion. 12 Comments

This is part 5 of a series. It begins here.

To potentially conclude this 5 part series on my dealings with the Mormons, I actually allowed them to come over to my house and try to convert me. We agreed on 6pm or earlier, so they came around 6:10.

When I spoke to them on the phone, it seemed that two of their sisters would come to my place for an hour or so. When the door was opened, I was surprised to see three of them, then even more shocked when four walked inside. I hurriedly cleaned up remnants from dinner, then allowed them to seat themselves at the dining room table. By this time, Joe and Brandon awkwardly decided to finish watching the King’s game in Joe’s room.

When I came back from the kitchen, I found all four of them sitting on one side of the table, not unlike the Da Vinci’s depiction of the Last Supper. I grabbed a chair and placed it opposite them, commenting on how it felt like an interrogation.

My original plan was to sit them down and tell them that I think their religion is a joke and that they should defend it without using the Book of Mormon. As usual, I lost my nerve when they were actually there. Sort of.

So now we were all sitting at the table, them on one side, me on the other. They explained that there’s a rule that instructs there to be another girl present, so they brought along the other two female missionaries. As it turns out, I wish they didn’t, as they were the ones who talked for a long time without really providing me with the things I was looking for.

Let me introduce the four:

Sister Brown: A Pacific Islander from Utah. The only one actually from Utah.

Sister (insert random letters here): Such a thick accent, I still have no idea where she’s from. She converted to the church along with her family, including her father, who was into ‘drinking and smoking’ (this became her mantra in the story of her conversion). She started every other sentence with my name. I’m sure someone somewhere told her it would make the listener feel more connected if you used his or her name often, but she was doing it so much, I felt a little uncomfortable.

Sister Harris: I think this one was the pack leader. From her voice, I could tell all of our correspondence was done through her. Very friendly and perky, the kind of girl you would expect to be a counselor at a religious summer camp or something. I think she was from Illinois.
Sister (I don’t remember; make up a white name): Picture a chubby white girl with asthma. People have made fun of her all her life so she’s built up a defensive personality. It seems like she has has to concentrate on breathing between sentences. I forget where she was from, but judging by her build, I’d go with somewhere in the Midwest. Somewhere where they eat a lot of… everything.

After reading those descriptions, I sure hope they don’t find this site. Although, knowing the Mormons, they’re watching me as I type this.

I should also point out that they were all somewhere in their mid-twenties. They seemed to be my peers, if not a little bit older. And aside from the big one, none of them were even remotely blonde. Sister Harris was very much a redhead (although she did have really blue eyes–point for me). The other two seemed likely to get some pretty good scholarships based on ethnicity, so no blondeness there. It seems one of my Mormon myths was busted on the spot.

So we began. As part of my plan, I didn’t tell them anything about myself beforehand. I wanted to leave them with no basis of where to stand. They were on my turf.

They opened with a prayer. I felt a little uncomfortable that they used my name, but I guess that’s just how they roll.

Since they had no idea where to begin, they started preaching Christianity to me. Actually, they were preaching prophets. I quickly learned that they really like prophets. Early on, they wanted to reference a verse, so they started pulling out their bibles. I asked if I should go get mine, to which they replied enthusiastically.

I hurried to my room and started pulling a mess of books off of my bookshelf. Remember, my turf. I brought my NRSV, Contemporary Parallel (8 translations), Book of Mormon, Greek New Testament, and my Oxford Commentary on the Bible. As I passed Joe’s room with this giant stack of books, I poked my head in and said, “I’m going to out-bible them.”

I sat down with my stack, pulled out the NRSV, and started flipping through to Amos (they really like Amos). Then it occurred to me. “What translation of the bible are you using?” I asked.

“The King James Version,” they replied.

“Hold on a sec,” I said, then ran back to my room for my KJV.

Once properly suited, I opened to the chapter and they asked me to read the verse. I suppose through me reading it, I was supposed to understand and believe their point. That was something that came up again.

I noticed that when it came to quoting verses, whoever happened to be speaking would open to that verse quickly, having already had it bookmarked. They had done this many times before.

So for the first hour or so, they were preaching Christianity. Their flow was great, so I didn’t feel justified in interrupting. When there was a pause, someone else would jump in with a verse, a personal story, or something that she “just loves.” There was a lot of just loving in our little meeting. “I just love this verse” or “I just love how we have prophets.” I just love just loving things.

I learned that the reason they put so much emphasis on the prophets is because they still have them. Apparently there’s a guy who speaks to God and will let them know that God doesn’t approve of shopping on Sundays (real life example).

Then they got into the Book of Mormon. There was a lot of stuff I didn’t really care about, so I started zoning out for a few minutes. I did remember that they were heavily oriented on faith. This is a traditional characteristic of religions, I know, but it felt like they were pushing it a bit. They kept on telling me to pray about the Book of Mormon and asking God if it was the true book.

There was a lot that they talked about that I didn’t feel justified in interrupting, so I let them talk. But finally, when they seemed to be winding down, they asked if I had any questions. This was my time to shine.

I asked them about the origins of the Book of Mormon then repeated their story in my own words for confirmation. From what I learned this time, Joseph Smith found the plates that were buried by an ancient somewhere in New York. He was 22 and had only received an 8th grade education. As well as the plates, he found the Urim and Thummim, which he used to translate the texts. Apparently he also used them to go back over the bible, so many Mormon bibles have alternative Joseph Smith translations at the bottom. Thanks, Joe.

I did my questioning about remaining original texts, to which they gave the same answer as the man on the phone. There seemed to be a lull in their spiel, so I started mine. It seems they were trained in converting people, not defending their religion from me. This was also different from any conversations I’ve had with friends about what I personally believe because it was conducted in a professional atmosphere. I had several good points, so I’ll try and remember them.

When I brought up the original texts, I compared it to the bible. One of the common acknowledgments even among Atheists is that Jesus was a man here on earth. He walked around and people wrote about him, even if only believing that he was the son of God. The things they wrote have been copied through the generations and have become a great part of the lives of many people in many languages. Yet even now, we are still finding old manuscripts that are in the same original language and maintain almost the exact same words.

When it comes to the Book of Mormon, we don’t have very convincing evidence that these prophets lived in the Americas in the time they are said to have lived here. The only record we have of their writings is what our poorly educated friend found and pretended to translate in 1820. Not only do we not have the original text, but we don’t even have proof of the original language. It feels like it leaves too big of holes for “faith” to cover up.

With their huge emphasis on prophets, I wanted to know what they believed. I asked them, “If your prophet were to proclaim something in contrast to the teachings of the Bible or Book of Mormon, who would you go with?” They muttered that the prophet would never contradict the bible, so I argued hypothetically. They answered as best they could, going with “whatever felt right in their hearts.”

It was at that point I brought up the point of polygamy. This is one of the most infamous parts of their religion, so it seems reasonable that they would have a rehearsed answer. Men go off to war, leave widows and families behind who need support. God tells the prophets it’s okay to have more than one wife, they go at it. The population stabilizes (and non-Mormons freak out), God tells the prophets it’s no longer okay. No more arguments.

Then I brought up the fact that the Mormons are very exclusive and don’t really welcome outsiders. They seemed a little confused and argued that there are always people who come and listen in at their church. It wasn’t until I mentioned the word “temple” that they did a collective, “Oh….”

They explained that the temple is the house of God and that it should be kept very clean. When I quoted that God does not dwell in houses made of human hands, they looked puzzled and asked where that was in the bible. I told them that I had seen their temples and found them garish and flashy, contradictory to the teachings of the New Testament.

They mentioned the temple in Sacramento, as it had just been renovated. Having recently talked to Riddy about it, I was armed with a few killer points. They were excited to see if I got to tour it before it was dedicated. I said that I did not, but I heard about it. I heard that after they closed it off to the public, they tore up the carpet and replaced it because it had been walked on by non-Mormons. They tried to defend it, saying that it was probably just dirty, then went on to explain how they make you wear plastic bags over your shoes when you go inside. Personally, I would love to have to wear booties when I worship God.

I explained how I interpreted Jesus’ words to mean that after the destruction of the temple in Jerusalem, there was no more need for an earthly edifice in which God would dwell. He would then dwell in the hearts of each individual.

To answer the question of how they paid for the temple, I brought up the whole money aspect. If you were unaware, the Mormons give 10% of their income to the church. When I told them that Jesus preached for free and that I didn’t think money should be a part of religion, they explained that they do in fact preach for free. They were preaching to me and not making me pay. In fact, when they go on their mission, they are required to pay money. Fancy that. But still, membership to the church requires a hefty monetary donation. This was one of my favorite parts. They were arguing that there are plenty of places in the bible that talk about tithing and its benefits. So they would turn to the left half of their bibles and start quoting.

” But that’s the Old Testament,” I explained. “Jesus came and preached that it was no longer necessary. You can’t quote from the Old Testament to try and negate something that Jesus changed.”

Unable to come to a good conclusion, they tried working faith back on me. The girl with the accent told me a somewhat comprehensible story about her father and his problems with smoking and drinking. “You know, Jeff,” she would say, “mumble mumble smoking and drinking.” That exact sentence was repeated for about ten minutes, the other three looking on with compassion. There was one time she was nearing the end of the sentence and concluded with “smoking.” I was actually a little excited when I heard this. But my excitement was cut short by an “and drinking” after finished inhaling.

The point of her story was that her father (a smoker and drinker) was against the Mormons. She prayed that if the Book of Mormon was true, her father would quit smoking and drinking. It was an inspirational story best left for an ESL class.

Still curious about their modern day prophets, I asked them another question. Since they couldn’t respond to any of my claims that they were practicing things contrary to what Jesus taught, I asked, “Do you believe your prophets are higher than Jesus?” They explained that the modern day prophets are on the same level as the Old Testament prophets. “Sure,” I replied. “But were those higher than Jesus?” Of course, they had to concede that Jesus was the Son of God, so no, human prophets were not greater than Jesus. Thus, even if a prophet told them that God wanted a ridiculous temple, they agreed that my interpretation of what Jesus taught was more valid. In retrospect, that seemed to answer an earlier question I had about the prophets in disagreement with the scriptures. How interesting.

Someone finally found the verse about God not dwelling in temples, which is in Acts 17. She then retorted to me, “So is Paul higher than Jesus?” This was the fat girl, the one with the little complex.

“No,” I replied disdainfully, “But he’s not contradicting anything Jesus said either.” End of argument.

Not thinking of any other questions off the top of my head, I brought out my real clincher. Knowing that none of them knew Greek, I asked, “So it’s unanimous throughout your church that you use the King James Version?” They agreed. “Why that version?”

This is a question I love asking people. To my knowledge, there is no good reason for sticking adamantly to the King James Version aside from an arbitrary decision to have one unified translation. Armed with my Greek New Testament, I waited for them to stop stammering and try and answer. It felt similar to pointing a gun at a fence and waiting for little rabbits to hop in view.

“Because it’s the oldest…” Nope.

“Because it’s the best translation…” Nope

“Because it uses an older style…” Nope, nope, nope.

As a classicist, I can tell you that the King James Version of the bible is inferior to many other modern translations. You’re not going to win this argument.

With that, we all seemed to be tired enough. We closed in another prayer (“Jeff, would you like to lead us in prayer?” “Not particularly.”), then we said our goodbyes. Four handshakes and thank yous later, I was alone in the quiet apartment. It was exhausting, but I felt like I had accomplished things. I learned a bit about the Mormon religion and had several arguments they could not refute. I guess it went as I expected.

In retrospect, this was a pretty harsh recap. If you happen to be Mormon, I apologize. I tend to be a bitter writer. Just check out the rest of this blog.

Continue reading here.

My Dealings With the Mormons, Part 4.5

Published on February 21, 2007 in Humor and Religion. 4 Comments

This is part 4.5 of a series. It begins here.

I just got a call confirming my meeting with the Mormons tomorrow. It’s so on, fellas.

Continue reading here.

My Dealings With the Mormons, Part 4

Published on February 14, 2007 in Humor and Religion. 2 Comments

This is part 4 of a series. It begins here.

A few nights ago, the Mormons called me back. There wasn’t a whole lot to the conversation besides the fact that we set up a time to meet. Also, they called at 8:30 on a Monday evening. I think they are incapable of calling earlier than 7:00 on any given night.

As we were ending the conversation, it occurred to me that I never gave them my address. When I pointed this out, the lady replied, “Do you still live at Da Vinci?” Ah, yes. They sent me a Book of Mormon. Every Mormon now knows everything I have told to any other Mormon. Only slightly creepy.

Continue reading here.